[ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

User avatar
Diegtiarov
Trespasser
Posts: 52
Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 08:34
Contact:

[ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Diegtiarov » 16 Mar 2017, 17:38

Hello.

As the subject says - how does Offline ALife simulate battles? Are there any configs for that beside those in creatures .ltxes?

User avatar
Alundaio
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
Posts: 1368
Joined: 26 May 2012, 22:26

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Alundaio » 16 Mar 2017, 18:34

There is no offline combat in CoP nor CoC. No plans to add it either.
"I have a dream that one day this community will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident; that all mods are created equal."

User avatar
Diegtiarov
Trespasser
Posts: 52
Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 08:34
Contact:

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Diegtiarov » 17 Mar 2017, 12:27

Eh, that sucks. Is it possible to port it from existing code Clear Sky has?

User avatar
Alundaio
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
Posts: 1368
Joined: 26 May 2012, 22:26

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Alundaio » 17 Mar 2017, 12:39

No. But warfare has it own.
"I have a dream that one day this community will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident; that all mods are created equal."

User avatar
Diegtiarov
Trespasser
Posts: 52
Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 08:34
Contact:

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Diegtiarov » 17 Mar 2017, 15:15

Are you sure you don't want to implement this feature (even as an optional)? ALife enabled on entire map which is about to come with next patch often likes to accumulate NPCs on some smarties which become a bloodbath when player enters the level.

morris
Scavenger
Posts: 12
Joined: 16 Feb 2017, 02:33

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby morris » 19 Mar 2017, 09:46

Alundaio wrote:No. But warfare has it own.


Which files are responsible for this feature then? Is it possible to port just that, not the whole Warfare mod? I dont like it too much, but this feature would fit nice with my implementations.

User avatar
Diegtiarov
Trespasser
Posts: 52
Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 08:34
Contact:

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Diegtiarov » 19 Mar 2017, 12:20

PM werejew on ModDB and he'll definitely share this with you.

Kimikim
Scavenger
Posts: 13
Joined: 21 Jul 2016, 16:00

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Kimikim » 19 Mar 2017, 15:02

Because the warfare mod IMO covers too much ground (also changing the decision making of squads, respawn behavior etc), I'm currently making my own mod which does not edit existing files and only adds offline combat.

Planned features ATM are actual combat (taking into account equipped weapon accuracy, recoil and DPS, and using NPCs' real immunities, and for mutants attack damage, speed etc... I'll explain in detail once it's released, the mutants are a bit tricky), notifications about combat via the existing dynamic news system, spawning of online-object corpses when player approaches spots where NPCs died in offline combat, distant noises of offline combat in the same level. The latter things will be added in updates after the first release, but I already finished the code for the first featured I listed, though I didn't put to it use yet.

Separately I will make addons that enable looting of corpses killed in offline combat, offline stashing of said loot when approaching carry weight limit, trading of said loot when idling with friendly/neutral squads, selling of said loot when idling near a trader, returning to created stashes to sell that loot, map icons of friendly squads and faction squads + enemy squads visible to the previous ones, and variations of the original mod with gradually less accurate simulations (in case the base mod is too performance heavy)... I think I had more ideas but I don't have my notes nearby :D

Optimisation is important to me since quite a lot of calculations are made for a script (as opposed to a program in native binary - fortunately Lua is relatively fast for an interpreted language, and LuaJIT ridiculously so), but I'm familiar with Lua's semantics and Alundaio has given me some implementation tips as well :D But because of this, and because I have trouble in general finding time to work on it, progress is slow :(

Thumba-umba
Scavenger
Posts: 15
Joined: 08 Aug 2017, 20:36

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Thumba-umba » 25 Aug 2017, 16:58

Kimikim wrote:Because the warfare mod IMO covers too much ground (also changing the decision making of squads, respawn behavior etc), I'm currently making my own mod which does not edit existing files and only adds offline combat.

Planned features ATM are actual combat (taking into account equipped weapon accuracy, recoil and DPS, and using NPCs' real immunities, and for mutants attack damage, speed etc... I'll explain in detail once it's released, the mutants are a bit tricky), notifications about combat via the existing dynamic news system, spawning of online-object corpses when player approaches spots where NPCs died in offline combat, distant noises of offline combat in the same level. The latter things will be added in updates after the first release, but I already finished the code for the first featured I listed, though I didn't put to it use yet.

Separately I will make addons that enable looting of corpses killed in offline combat, offline stashing of said loot when approaching carry weight limit, trading of said loot when idling with friendly/neutral squads, selling of said loot when idling near a trader, returning to created stashes to sell that loot, map icons of friendly squads and faction squads + enemy squads visible to the previous ones, and variations of the original mod with gradually less accurate simulations (in case the base mod is too performance heavy)... I think I had more ideas but I don't have my notes nearby :D

Optimisation is important to me since quite a lot of calculations are made for a script (as opposed to a program in native binary - fortunately Lua is relatively fast for an interpreted language, and LuaJIT ridiculously so), but I'm familiar with Lua's semantics and Alundaio has given me some implementation tips as well :D But because of this, and because I have trouble in general finding time to work on it, progress is slow :(


Is there a way to track the progress? Will you make a subpage on MODDB? Sounds promising. I am yet to find a single proper offline addon that would pay attetion to details instead of just adding MOAR ASSPLOSIONS.

xenomorf
Scavenger
Posts: 9
Joined: 10 Sep 2014, 03:48

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby xenomorf » 26 Aug 2017, 02:36

Offline combat only make sense in faction wars related stuff or so while quite opposite in vanilla. Unnecessary heavy on memory usage etc. What is the point really that a dog spawn in Generators and got killed minute later by pseudogiant, while player dealing with Sid in Cordon ;D IMO it will make Zone more static and predictable. But I'm not saying that I won't be interested in addon like this(cause I will), only that in default offline combat is disabled for a reason. Good luck with the mod!

Thumba-umba
Scavenger
Posts: 15
Joined: 08 Aug 2017, 20:36

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Thumba-umba » 26 Aug 2017, 04:48

xenomorf wrote:Offline combat only make sense in faction wars related stuff or so while quite opposite in vanilla. Unnecessary heavy on memory usage etc. What is the point really that a dog spawn in Generators and got killed minute later by pseudogiant, while player dealing with Sid in Cordon ;D IMO it will make Zone more static and predictable. But I'm not saying that I won't be interested in addon like this(cause I will), only that in default offline combat is disabled for a reason. Good luck with the mod!


It's just a new layer that furthers the game from being player-centered. When bandits all of a sudden start shooting monolith on a smart, once i get close, despite being spawned together on said smart 20 ingame hours ago, or when i find stalkers with 12 AKMs, Saigas and G36s accumulated in their inventory - i am instantly reminded that there is no offline trade/combat/progression for NPC and nothing ever happens if i am not there to look at it.

Kimikim
Scavenger
Posts: 13
Joined: 21 Jul 2016, 16:00

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Kimikim » 27 Aug 2017, 06:16

The project is on hiatus at the moment - and has been for months already - because a work opportunity came up (which has dragged on for long but not actually started yet :/), but I might publish what I've done so far and notes on how I was planning to do other things since it seems I won't have time to properly work on it for quite long. I was suspecting this might happen which is why I tried to make the scripts as independent as possible, so as to not need re-implementing into existing scripts after updates.

I agree with both of you :D From a storyteller point of view, there is little reason to be progressing the story of every single creature that might partake in the story, when there is only one point to view the story from. The listener (player) won't even notice any difference.

On the other hand, I'm also not satisfied with how the world "appears" to the player. Creatures and people appear out of nowhere with equipment that don't make sense compared to what the player learns he won't survive without, and the types of items they have all follow a similar pattern. Enemy squads occupying neighbouring camps appear to hold a ceasefire for as long as the player has business elsewhere in the zone. STALKERs don't appear to travel, but rather roam aimlessly, never making any progress, changing gear and so on. It even bothers me when there is ambience indicating combat, but no actual combat going on.

Then there's the new possibilities that a fully simulated A-life would bring; automatic, procedural balancing between factions and NPCs, NPC inventories that reflect the environment it is and has been in, impermanent stashes, the ranking of STALKERs would fluctuate, etc etc. But to be honest, I think the biggest reason I want it simulated is just because knowing how it actually works now ruins the immersion for me x)

User avatar
Diegtiarov
Trespasser
Posts: 52
Joined: 12 Nov 2015, 08:34
Contact:

Re: [ALife] How does Offline ALife simulate battles between NPCs/other creatures?

Postby Diegtiarov » 27 Aug 2017, 11:55

Well, I'm currently stuck with C++ and will move on to LUA as soon as I figure it out. Then I will probably make my own vision of the simulation, either re-building current one or making something new on top of that.

No sooner than 5 months from now, though.


Return to “General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests